Episode 72 Show Notes

Episode 72. This week John and Timothy explore the Kamoshibito Kuehiji brand. It’s a very old brewery, founded in 1647 and located just outside Nagoya City in Aichi Prefecture. Under the guidance of the current brewery president Mr. Kuheiji Kuno, the Kuehiji brand takes strong inspiration from the French wine world’s notion of a “Domaine”. The brewery, wanting more oversight of its raw materials, purchased land in Hyogo Prefecture to grow their own in-house yamadanishiki rice. And the influence of French wine culture can also be seen on the bottle of their flagship Kamoshibito Kuheiji brand. The rice harvest vintage year is featured prominently along with a French name for the sake as well. In our case, we are tasting the “Eau du Désir” (Water of Desire). This sake is a wonderful blending of sake making craftsmanship with a nod to the world of french wine, namely a notably higher acidity and a long lingering finish. If someone gives you a taste of this sake, you may not know whether to say arigato or merci, but we think you’ll find it delicious.


Skip to: 00:19 Show Opening
Welcome to the show from John and Timothy


Skip to: 02:46 Brewery Profile: Kamoshibito Kuehiji (Banjo Jozo)
About Banjo Jozo

Image © Kamoshibito Kuheiji
  • Banjo Jozo brewery was founded in 1647 and is located in Nagoya City, Aichi Prefecture, Japan
  • Current Kuramoto (brewery president) is Kuheiji Kuno
  • Kuno-san is deeply influenced by wine culture and incorporates the ideas of “domaine” into his businesses
  • Eau du Desir is the flagship sake in the portfolio and is produced from the brewery’s own rice fields in Hyogo Prefecture
  • This sake brewery is also producing wine in Burgundy, France

Find Kamoshibito Kuheiji on Social Media
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kamoshibito_kuheiji/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kamoshibito.kuheiji/
Website: https://kuheiji.co.jp/
UrbanSake: https://www.urbansake.com/sake-guide/banjo-jozo-brewery/


Skip to: 16:36 Sake Introduction and Tasting : Kamoshibito Kuheiji Eau Du Desir Junmai Daiginjo

Kamoshibito Kuheiji Eau Du Desir Junmai Daiginjo


Brewery: Banjo Jozo Brewery
Alcohol: 16.0%
Acidity: 1.7
Classification: Junmai Daiginjo
Prefecture: Aichi
Rice Type: Yamadanishiki
Seimaibuai: 50%
Importer: Sake Suki, LLC
Sake Name English: Water of Desire
SMV: ±0

View on UrbanSake.com: Kamoshibito Kuheiji Eau Du Desir Junmai Daiginjo


Skip to: 30:07 Show Closing

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Episode 72 Transcript

[00:00:00] John Puma: Hello, everybody. Welcome to Sake Revolution. This is America’s first sake podcast. I’m one of your hosts, Jon Puma from the Sake Notes. Also the admin over the internet sake discord, that guy over at right it’s r/sake. the guy on the show who is not the sake samurai.

[00:00:44] Timothy Sullivan: And I am your host, Timothy Sullivan. I am a sake samurai, and also a sake educator. I’m also the founder of the Urban Sake website and every week John and I will be here tasting and chatting about all things, sake and doing our best to make it fun and easy to understand. Yes.

[00:01:04] John Puma: we’re, we’re, we’re back to him. We’re back this week with another brand profile. I have been loving These these are a lot of fun.

[00:01:13] Timothy Sullivan: Very fun. It has to dig a little deeper into one brand and we have a doozy. We have a doozy this week.

[00:01:20] John Puma: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so the name of this brand always makes me laugh a little bit.

[00:01:28] Timothy Sullivan: W w Why does it make you laugh?

[00:01:30] John Puma: All right. So, uh, one time we were in one of our favorite izakayas, in shimbashi called, Magokoro Ishii, and myshell was doing her crazy style thing, which where people who are new to the show, my, my wife, when we go to Japan, she will often ask in, uh, in bars or izakayas if they have any sake that is crazy style. And that may sound a little strange, but somehow, this always gets a sake that fits a particular description of just something really weird and funky and different. Um, oh wait. That’s not very particular, is it? But it always gets her something that’s very weird or funky or different. Um, this time though, Ishii san was actually helping some other customers and one of the chefs actually came over and she asked him that and he, or the refrigerator and he kinda, uh, rubbed his chin for a few moments and he came back and. Well, we don’t have anything crazy, but this sake has called Kuheiji so this is Kuheiji style

[00:02:42] Timothy Sullivan: That’s a good

[00:02:43] John Puma: the rest That’s a good that’s a good one. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:02:46] Timothy Sullivan: Yes. So this brand is a mouthful Kamoshibito Kuheiji

[00:02:53] John Puma: Mm.

[00:02:53] Timothy Sullivan: Kamoshibito Kuheiji that’s the brand name and the brewery is Called Banjo Jozo then anywhere near narrow, narrow, narrow, narrow.

[00:03:06] John Puma: that. I wasn’t, I wasn’t in thinking banjo. but

[00:03:08] John Puma: yeah, I guess they

[00:03:09] Timothy Sullivan: It’s spelled banjo, but it’s banjo, Banjo Jozo. And this is from Aichi prefecture. And it’s about the brewery is about a 15 minute drive from Nagoya.

[00:03:20] John Puma: Oh,

[00:03:20] Timothy Sullivan: Yep. So that’s uh, on the main island of Japan towards the Pacific ocean west of west of Tokyo.

[00:03:27] John Puma: Nice. I feel like we don’t get that much sake from aichi prefecture over here.

[00:03:32] Timothy Sullivan: Not a lot now. Kuheiji is a well-known brand in Japan. And I’ve heard this described as a cult sake before.

[00:03:41] John Puma: Yeah. Yeah. I’ve heard the same. It is another one of those very, uh, you know, popular, uh, boutique-y brand. You see it on social media a lot. Uh, it’s very much, um, you know, it’s a brand that, that has fans and they get very excited.

[00:03:58] Timothy Sullivan: They sure do. And we’ve had some brand profiles in the past on the show where the younger generation of brewer takes over a little bit inspired by the world of wine and they create a unique style of sake. And I think that is the story here as well, but kind of turned up to 11. Well, that’s the, the president of this brewery, his name is Kuheiji Kuno .

[00:04:23] Timothy Sullivan: He’s the 15th generation Kuramoto or 15th generation brewery president. And this is

[00:04:30] John Puma: 15 generations. That means this, this place has been around for a while

[00:04:34] Timothy Sullivan: Yes. brewery was founded in 1647.

[00:04:40] John Puma: Whew. Uh,

[00:04:43] Timothy Sullivan: That’s a lot of ancestors.

[00:04:45] John Puma: Yeah. Wow.

[00:04:47] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. So he took the brand in a completely different direction. And as we’ll discuss and as will taste, I’m sure he was very inspired by the world of wine, the culture of wine, and basically remade his brewery in many ways. In the image of what a winery can be in your old world winery. So that’s our jumping off point for exploring this brand.

[00:05:19] John Puma: Mm. Yeah. And that, that is a, that’s, uh, a familiar tale at this point of, uh, you know, somebody takes over the brewery, they’re inspired by wine and then they go and do exciting, different things. So, um, Yeah. let’s dive in.

[00:05:34] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. So I got the bottle. Of the Kamoshibito Kuheiji, we’re going to be tasting obviously one of their sake today. And I was checking out the bottle before the show and there’s a QR code on the back of the label that said, if you want to learn more about our rice fields and our philosophy follow this QR code. So I did,

[00:05:54] John Puma: All right.

[00:05:55] Timothy Sullivan: it took me to their website, which very clearly outlined. Three of their businesses, which all kind of tie in to their philosophy. So the, the first part of their business that they outline on the website is named after their brand Kamoshibito Kuheiji and that is their sake brewery. That’s located outside of Nagoya aichi, Japan, and that’s been their home base for centuries. And that’s where they produce their sake. So that’s the first prong of their business. And they believe very deeply in the concept of domaine, which we’ve talked about with the other brewers, right. That

[00:06:41] John Puma: Right. I believe it was a Domaine Senkin.

[00:06:44] Timothy Sullivan: yes, and in 2010, said we use Yamada Nishiki rice in our sake. They only make Junmai Daiginjo.

[00:06:53] John Puma: Mm.

[00:06:54] Timothy Sullivan: And he said, if we want the best Yamada Nishiki, we have to have rice fields in Hyogo. So they went to Hyogo to a town called Kurodasho and they purchased rice fields. I can only imagine how expensive this land was to grow Yamada nishiki,

[00:07:13] John Puma: I can’t imagine that rice fields in Hyogo are aren’t going on at discount rate right now, or in the recent past.

[00:07:21] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. So for our listeners, Hyogo prefecture is ground zero for Yamahai Nishiki and Yamada Nishiki is known as the king of sake rice. If you want to make the most exclusive sake, this is the most exclusive raw material you can grow. And He wanted agency. He wanted control over the yamada Nishiki not just to buy it from somebody else.

[00:07:47] John Puma: right, right. A lot of breweries will buy rice from farmers from different estates in Hyogo.

[00:07:56] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah, it definitely thinking outside the box.

[00:07:59] John Puma: Yeah.

[00:08:00] Timothy Sullivan: All the breweries I’ve visited and know really well. They all have generation long relationships with rice farmers, and it’s like the symbiotic relationship where this family grows the rice, this family makes the sake and they have contracts and long-term relationships with each other. So, this is really thinking outside of the box of saying we’re a Nagoya sake brewery, and we’re going to go toHyogo and buy our own land and grow our own Yamada Nishiki. So that started in 2010. And I also read on their website that there’s plans to build a sake production facility there as well.

[00:08:33] John Puma: Oh,

[00:08:33] Timothy Sullivan: It’s not completed yet, but they want to make their a second brand Kurodasho, which is. Name of the area. So they’re going to have Domaine Kurodasho for their own Hyogo grown Yamadanishiki.

[00:08:50] John Puma: that’s interesting, you know, from some breweries that I’ve visited in the past, I’ve heard, the concept that sake making really does begin in the rice field, if you grow the rice in a manner that, that you want, that you’re going to get things out of it when you’re trying to make sake. Well, otherwise it wouldn’t necessarily be there. You have so much more control over it when you are actually choosing how, you know, what to feed the rice and when, and how much water and blah, blah, blah, and all that other fun stuff.

[00:09:21] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah, they definitely live and breathe that philosophy. I think at this brewery.

[00:09:27] John Puma: It seems like they take it to another level.

[00:09:30] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. when we talked about Senkin and they said that all the rice to make the sake was within five minutes of the brewery. And that is that same concept of domaine that Kuheiji is really taking to another level here where they’re growing their own rice. And they’re actually building a brewery right there on location. And I think that the sakes from that brand are going to start coming out maybe later this year or next year. So they’re not available yet. And then if that was not enough to. The Kuheiji brand has expanded to France. So we meant

[00:10:10] John Puma: sake sake there?

[00:10:11] Timothy Sullivan: They’re making wine there.

[00:10:14] John Puma: What,

[00:10:14] Timothy Sullivan: Wine.

[00:10:16] John Puma: so he’s so excited about wine then. So influenced by wine that he’s actually going and learning how to make wine also.

[00:10:22] Timothy Sullivan: Yes. So the owner of this centuries, old sake brewery. So fell in love with wine that he started a brand Domaine Kuheiji in Burgundy, France,

[00:10:36] John Puma: That’s awesome.

[00:10:37] Timothy Sullivan: Burgundy is like, you can’t get any more French wine-y than burgundy, right? Isn’t that like the ultimate French wine?, the Junmai Daiginjo Of Wine?

[00:10:45] John Puma: Asking the wrong person.

[00:10:46] Timothy Sullivan: I don’t know either. I’m guessing it’s a highly regarded area in wine country and they’re in a town called Maurice Saint Denis, Dennis Denis. I apologize for my French pronunciation. So they are in the heart of burgundy, which is hardcore wine country in France.

[00:11:09] John Puma: uh, the fact that I’ve heard of it probably means it’s, it’s pretty hardcore.

[00:11:17] Timothy Sullivan: And they are selling some of their wines that they’re making there at Domaine Kuheiji. And I looked at one, one type of, they have four or five kinds of wine there, and one bottle was selling for about $149. So it’s not cheap wine, but I’m sure it’s very, very delicious. So. Have three levels of this business going on that all tie very deeply into the sense of domaine and the sense of place and the sense of growing your own materials and having those express the sense of place for your, for your sake or your wine. So very deep.

[00:12:03] John Puma: It’s very, very terroir.

[00:12:05] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah.

[00:12:06] John Puma: Wow.

[00:12:07] Timothy Sullivan: We have talked a little bit about the Kuheiji Brand you and I both have a bottle of one of their really, without a doubt, this is their flagship sake. So if you wouldn’t mind, can you give us an intro to the stats on this?

[00:12:24] John Puma: sure. So, um, this is the Kamoshibito Kuheiji. Junmai Daiginjo. Eau Du Desir? year. I hope I’m getting that right.

[00:12:37] Timothy Sullivan: That’s French by the way,

[00:12:38] John Puma: that is,

[00:12:40] Timothy Sullivan: And what does that mean? Eau Du Desir.

[00:12:43] John Puma: oh, dude, this here. Thank you. That’s so much better, than my pronunciation . was. apparently it’s water of desire.

[00:12:50] Timothy Sullivan: Woo.

[00:12:51] John Puma: That is the best name, uh, for a sake. I think, I think it also works better in French because you know, most things sound a little bit better.

[00:13:02] Timothy Sullivan: Yes. So using the French name on the Japanese sake label, that’s another nod to his love of French wine.

[00:13:11] John Puma: Yeah,

[00:13:12] John Puma: clearly, clearly. Um, so, uh, the water of desire, uses, Yamadanishiki as you pointed out, the yamadanishiki milled to 50%, the, uh, sake meter value is a nice even zero. So that’d be interesting, probably be right in the middle between sweet and dry. Um, The alcohol percentage is 16%. So again, just kind of right. in that normal, uh, normal area, normal range. And as you mentioned earlier, the prefecture is Aichi. Um, one other note here is the rice year. Now you want to talk about that?

[00:13:52] Timothy Sullivan: Well, there is a label. On this sake, the neck label says, Eau Du Désir, junmai Daiginjo. So water of desire. And then right underneath that, there’s a gold label that says 2019 in big numbers. And I went and I looked at their website in a little more detail. And this vintage number that is on the front label is the rice harvest vintage.

[00:14:21] John Puma: Yeah. that’s another nod to wine. I want to say. Cause that’s definitely something that I’ve seen on the other end of

[00:14:27] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah.

[00:14:28] John Puma: Fascinating.

[00:14:29] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. And I just want to say one thing about this vintage. I mean, it could not, if you look at the bottle, it could not be more prominently featured than this gold sticker, right on the front. The one takeaway that I have from this brand after researching them and reading about them and watching videos is that vintages are O K.

[00:14:51] John Puma: Okay.

[00:14:52] Timothy Sullivan: And that’s not in the world of wine. That is not an unusual statement to make. But in my experience, I don’t know what you think, John, but vintages are very uncommon in the world of sake.

[00:15:07] John Puma: Yeah.

[00:15:08] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah., what I was taught when I was learning how to make sake is that you want to create a duplicate of the flavor from year to year to year. If you buy this brand of sake, This year and you buy it again next year. You want it to taste the same.

[00:15:23] John Puma: Okay.

[00:15:25] Timothy Sullivan: And one of the big things that I think kuno san is changing as he is embracing the changes in rice from year to year, and he’s embracing vintages and saying, vintages are. Again, if you’re a wine lover, this may not sound radical, but for for the sake

[00:15:41] John Puma: of us. It’s it’s very weird.

[00:15:43] Timothy Sullivan: for the sake lovers out there, it’s not the usual way things are done.

[00:15:48] Timothy Sullivan: , there is more French on the label though.

[00:15:50] John Puma: There is more French on the label.

[00:15:51] Timothy Sullivan: I feel like I need a French dictionary to drink this sake. Okay. So underneath, Eau Du Désir water of desire. It says Riz Cultive sur nos terres, which I think means rice cultivated on our lands

[00:16:10] John Puma: Awesome.

[00:16:11] Timothy Sullivan: possibly.

[00:16:13] John Puma: The last person you should be asking

[00:16:15] Timothy Sullivan: for, for all of our French speaking listeners out there, you should. No, I’m so sorry for pronouncing that the way I did. I studied German in college. So when we get to, when we get to German wines, I’m going to be great. But for now I’m a little bit lost. So should we get this open and get this in the glass

[00:16:36] John Puma: Let’s do it, Tim. I am ready to, uh, to experience the Domaine Kuheiji. Well, that’s the wine I

[00:16:44] Timothy Sullivan: That

[00:16:45] Timothy Sullivan: is the one. That’s

[00:16:45] John Puma: It’s the one. That’s the burgundy. I’m ready to taste this. Uh, the sake. I’m very excited about it.

[00:16:50] Timothy Sullivan: Okay. I’m going to pour in the glass.

[00:16:59] John Puma: All right, Tim. So we’ve poured our, Eau Du Désir. And what’s the first thing that you noticed?

[00:17:08] Timothy Sullivan: well, I would not guess that this is charcoal filtered because it has a little bit of a yellowish cast to it,

[00:17:18] John Puma: I agree. One other thing I noticed is it has a tiny little bit Of bubbles.

[00:17:27] Timothy Sullivan: Yes. When I opened it, I got a little pop.

[00:17:30] John Puma: Yeah, I got that. I got that. pop also. Um, I, I do believe this was, aged in bottle and that’s definitely something that I’ve experienced in other sakes that are similarly, uh, similarly treated. But Yeah. so it’s got a little bit of that little, little lively still.

[00:17:46] Timothy Sullivan: yep. Yeah. So everything that we’re going to say about this sake, I am. Filtering through a lens of the brewer is a wine fanatic, obviously. So that’s kind of in the back of my mind as we go through this tasting.

[00:18:05] John Puma: Nice.

[00:18:06] Timothy Sullivan: let’s give it a smell . Hmm, I’m getting pineapple and pear and apple fruity.

[00:18:19] John Puma: I’m also getting a bit of that, but I’m also getting some, uh, It’s also reminding me of a bit of a white wine on the nose.

[00:18:30] John Puma: Like definitely has that like, kind of like a, um, almost like a, a Chardonnay.

[00:18:36] Timothy Sullivan: I couldn’t agree. More, John, very much a wine, like Aroma me, I’m getting pineapple, pear, apple, very gentle fruits, not so much melon or banana, but more like, uh, uh, pineapple and maybe guava All right, let’s give it a taste. It’s a little bit sweeter than I expected.

[00:19:04] John Puma: Yes.

[00:19:05] Timothy Sullivan: It’s sweet.

[00:19:06] John Puma: yeah, I mean, it’s not overly sweet, but the, there is Hmm. When there were some acidity at play here as well. A nice amount of acidity at play here.

[00:19:20] Timothy Sullivan: And a long finish it’s lingering on my palate

[00:19:23] John Puma: Mm. The mouth feel is really, really, nice. Yeah.

[00:19:31] Timothy Sullivan: it’s juicy and fruity, and it’s making my mouth water like a high acid wine. You know, you’re getting that bright acidity. Again, I’m getting pineapple flavors, higher acid very much like, uh, you know, a bright, refreshing white.

[00:19:57] John Puma: Yeah. it’s, it’s actually, it’s it’s it has some of those white wine qualities that you mentioned, but it’s taking just a little bit from that and it’s pairing it really nicely with some of the best qualities of. Of a 50% milled Junmai Daiginjo that has been Aged in bottle. Like it has that, that vibrant to it. It has that, um, that fruit that’s just that fruit interplay. There is really nice. It’s this is very unique. This is very special. I like this a lot.

[00:20:29] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. From my point of view, my opinion, what I think the sake component of this is you picked right up on it as really the texture, the smooth characteristic of it. Junmai Daiginjo sakes have this silkiness to them. Yeah. And this really brings that to the party. Don’t you.

[00:20:49] John Puma: totally. Yeah. And the, and the two seem to be getting along famously.

[00:20:56] Timothy Sullivan: Well, this is a Japanese wine, loving sake brewer, probably making the sake of his dreams. because this really is their flagship sake. This is their main representative. And it sounds like he has big plans for the future wanting to continue to grow his sake brand in Hyogo.

[00:21:20] John Puma: Yeah.

[00:21:20] Timothy Sullivan: I’m very much going to look forward to those Kurodasho brands that are going to come out from this maker, moving some production to Hyogo and all those expressions of Yamada Nishiki that they’re going to create. But I think if anyone needs a little summary of what this brand is all about,

[00:21:42] John Puma: Hmm.

[00:21:43] Timothy Sullivan: don’t you think this is like the encapsulation of their philosophy?

[00:21:48] John Puma: I mean, it certainly, it, it certainly tastes that way to me. And, it lends itself to a second, third, fourth, fifth sip. It doesn’t get in the way of itself. It doesn’t like build up in your mouth or anything like that. It’s just very pleasant, very welcome that mouth feel. And the texture is so, so nice. And it serves a wonderful platform to deliver that acidity and that, and that fruit interplay. It’s so nice.

[00:22:14] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. And it goes without saying that we need to drink this in a wine glass.

[00:22:19] John Puma: Uh, Yeah. I mean, Yeah. I mean, we always say that you should have sake in your wine glasses. Cause you’ve already, got the wine glasses at home, but Yeah. especially this one it’s doubly true here. I think that, uh, I think that having this in a wine glass is most definitely the Brewer’s intent.

[00:22:35] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. Let me ask you something, John, if you had a friend who was really into wine and always poo-pooed sake would never have sake with you, and they’re a big wine lover. Would you use this as kind of a lure to bring them over to the world of sake? Or do you think that’s kind of false advertising?

[00:22:54] John Puma: I would like to put this in front of them. Th the, the thing is they worry that they would see it as a, As a, as an inferior white wine,

[00:23:07] Timothy Sullivan: Oh, I never thought of that.

[00:23:09] John Puma: Right. but it’s not trying to be a white wine is trying to be a sake it’s influenced by white wine. And that was my first thought. But then I thought back to last week show, we had a very similar conversation when we were sipping on the Koshu and the idea was. If we put this in front of somebody who liked whiskey, would they like this? And I like whiskey. And in fact, I think I mentioned that that’s like, that’s. yeah. That’s the part of my brain that really got engaged when, when sipping on that sake. And I think that if it goes the same way for this, then they really would enjoy that. They would pick up on those white wine pieces of it and be like, wait a second. Like, this is. Playing in my territory and it’s, and it’s really great because this is, you know, this is really delicious stuff. It’s really wonderful. I think that it can do things with texture that that may be the white wine. that its reminding us of can’t. Uh, and that’s really nice.

[00:24:12] John Puma: Okay.

[00:24:13] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. I’ve given sake eight to a lot of wine lovers and whiskey lovers and people all over the country. And there are some people that just have a mental block. Against other like they’re, they’re like, I’m a Chardonnay lover. And that’s it. Like, I can’t go outside my box. There are people like that out in the world, but the majority of people I’ve given, a sake. Like this too, I’ve found that you can use it as a bridge to kind of see, show them like, oh, look, look, what sake can do. This is, has one foot in your wheel house. Give it a try. And most people are. Open to other flavors and not so closed off to those experiences. And I’ve found that it does work really well to open people up to a new experience with sake. So in that way, I think a sake, like this is a real treasure because, you know, you can bring this to any white wine lover. And I think that for the most part, they’ll go crazy for it.

[00:25:15] John Puma: I’ll have to find a white wine lover and test this theory because

[00:25:19] Timothy Sullivan: Calling all white wine

[00:25:20] John Puma: Yes, the problem is that they’re like, they’re going to have to get their own because I really like this and I’m not gonna keep it around the house much longer. I don’t think if you know what I’m saying. Um, it’s, it’s very delicious. And then I’m going to, uh, going to be sipping on it, uh, very rapidly in the next few days. I think

[00:25:38] Timothy Sullivan: wink, wink, nudge,

[00:25:39] John Puma: wink, wink, nudge. nudge.

[00:25:41] Timothy Sullivan: Now, since we were talking about wine before we go, I do have to ask you about food pairing and the sake because wine and food pairing is a whole world unto itself. And this is a unique sake. Do you have any thoughts on how you would want to serve this or what you might pair it with?

[00:26:02] John Puma: Uh, not really. Oh, um, so I’ve been thinking about that a bit, because I know that this question often comes up it’s such an elegant sake and I know it has those white wine notes to it, but it’s, I don’t want to mess this up You know, I want to have this exactly the way I’m having it right now. So this is something I would have alone. It is a Junmai Daiginjo and that is something that sometimes you’re going to do a little bit by itself, treated a little bit special. Uh, and that’s, that’s the way I see this. I want to treat this with some. Uh, some deference than I want I don’t want to mess with it at all, but that’s also a cop out. Um,

[00:26:41] Timothy Sullivan: we gotta eat. We gotta

[00:26:42] John Puma: got to eat I got to eat. Having said that I’m going to defer to you because I’m awful at this.

[00:26:47] Timothy Sullivan: Well, I, I had one thought when I was drinking this, there are some fish dishes, like a poached white fish or poached Cod or a poached halibut that, have these wonderful li light sauces on them. And it’s a flaky white fish, little bit of acidity in the sauce, a squeeze of lemon on it. And that type of flavor is very neutral and begging for other flavors to be layered upon it. Like, you know, wonderful light butter sauce. And. Like I said a squeeze of acidity in there, and I think that type of flavor would go really well with this. It’s when I started sipping on this, I was like going through the Rolodex in my mind of dishes I’ve had, and it’s like, you know, halibut or white fish, gently poached just popped into my head. And that sounds so good. And I’ve recently been getting into salads, more, trying to eat a little bit more healthy. So. I’ve been, Hey, how about that? So I’ve been thinking more about salads too, and all the different things you can do with a nice fresh summer salad, baby spinach, and a lemon vinegarette. Again, I’m picking up on the acidity here, wanting something with that squeeze of lemon on it, to pick up on the really lovely wine, like acidity in this sake. I think that would work well.

[00:28:22] John Puma: Yeah.

[00:28:22] Timothy Sullivan: do you, what do you think of those?

[00:28:23] John Puma: I like that, especially like the idea of the Whitefish with a little bit of lemon, it’s not going to, to push itself, on the sake. That’s not going to be able to kind of lead the lead the way and it, and that’s going to go nicely. And then you mentioned that a little bit of citrus, that’s going to go a long way with, to compliment the acidity.

[00:28:41] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. One of the things I love the most about the sake is the finish. It is long it’s lingering and. It’s great for sipping slowly while you’re enjoying lunch. And just, just wonderful. So this is a great, great sake for wine lovers. I’m picturing myself on the French Riviera having this poached fish

[00:29:06] John Puma: I think great for sake lovers too personally.

[00:29:10] Timothy Sullivan: Okay. Absolutely. Yeah. This has been great.

[00:29:14] John Puma: Okay.

[00:29:15] Timothy Sullivan: So. We’ll have to check back in with this brand. I, as I mentioned, I know they’re finishing construction of that brewery in Hyogo, so it’ll be fun to have a part two episode two, the brand profile of Kamoshibito Kuehiji and see what they’re up to with the rices that they’re growing themselves in Hyogo.

[00:29:39] John Puma: I’m excited. Um, Yeah. this is, uh, the first item that they’re importing, uh, for us here in

[00:29:45] John Puma: the U S and I look forward to many more.

[00:29:50] Timothy Sullivan: Yeah. I’m excited to see what they, they bring over next and I’m going to have my French dictionary ready to go for the next label.

[00:29:59] John Puma: Excellent. Excellent. I hopefully at some point somebody will start playing German on the bottles and he’ll be, he’ll have a leg up on everybody. Okay.

[00:30:07] Timothy Sullivan: Well, John, uh, Merci Merci beaucoup for enjoying, Eau du Desir with me today? Okay. I’ve embarrassed myself enough. Uh, all right. Any language, John, thank you so much for sipping with me again today. This was a lot of fun, and I also want to thank all of our listeners so much for tuning in. We really do hope that you’re enjoying our show. Now, if you’d like to show your support for sake revolution, the best way to help us out would be to back us on Patreon. We are a listener supported show with no advertisements and we really do appreciate each and every one of you.

[00:30:47] John Puma: We do, and there are a lot of ways to support us, listening to the show with supporting us, going out and telling your friends is supporting us, sending us good vibes, supporting us. As Tim mentioned, going to Patreon.com/SakeRevolution also supports us in a really big way. And you can also go to your podcast platform of choice and leave. Yeah. Review, uh, let other people know what you think of Sake Revolution and also make this show a little bit easier to find when people are kind of looking around for a sake podcasts.

[00:31:20] Timothy Sullivan: Okay. And as always, if you would like to learn more about any of the topics, any of the brands or any of the sakes we tasted in today’s episode, be sure to visit our website, SakeRevolution.com. And there you can check out all the detailed show notes.

[00:31:36] John Puma: And if you have a sake question that you need answered, and we know you, do we want to hear from you, please reach out to us. The email address is [email protected]keRevolution.com. So until next time, please remember to keep drinking sake and

[00:31:59] Timothy Sullivan: Kanpai!