Episode 128 Show Notes
Episode 128. Week in and week out, our standard gear for tasting and evaluating sake is a simple wine glass. This works really well and almost everybody has one nearby. But in Japan, there are a wide variety of shapes, materials and sizes used to make cups for drinking sake. That got us wondering if we should take some other cups out for a test drive and compare them to our usual stemware. This week we are exploring an icon in modern design – the Sori Yanagi Sake Glass. With a solid glass foot, and a clear, minimalist bowl, the Yanagi glass is perhaps the most ubiquitous sake cup design of the post war period. How does this design stack up agains our standard wine glass? tune in this week to find out! #sakerevolution
Skip to: 00:19 Hosts Welcome and Introduction
Welcome to the show from John and Timothy
Skip to: 01:48 Sake Vessels: Yanagi Glass
About Sori Yanagi
-Quoted From Wikipedia
“Sōri Yanagi (柳 宗理, Yanagi Sōri, 1915–2011) was a Japanese industrial designer.[2] is one of the most famous product designers in Japan. He played a role in Japanese modern design developed from after World War 2 to the high-growth period in the Japanese economy. He is both a representative of the wholly Japanese modern designer and a full-blown modernist who merged simplicity and practicality with elements of traditional Japanese crafts.
Early life
He was born in 1915 in Tokyo, Japan, as the son of Soetsu Yanagi, who founded the “mingei” movement which celebrated Japanese folk crafts and the beauty of everyday objects. Soetsu helped establish the Nihon Mingeikon, the Folk Crafts Museum of Japan. Sori entered Tokyo Art School in 1934, where he studied both art and architecture. He was influenced by Le Corbusier as well as by Charlotte Perriand when she worked in Japan in the early 1940s. So, his interests moved from painting to buildings to design and objects.
Designs
After World War II, he designed many products: furniture, three-wheeled vehicles, Olympic cauldrons, pedestrian overpasses, etc. One of the most famous pieces of furniture is his Butterfly Stool. Announced in 1956, its’ 2-piece form has been compared to a butterfly’s open wings. Alternately, the shape can be seen as the gateway of a Shinto shrine or even an antique samurai helmet. In effect, it is a form that is both modern and timeless, that has won critical acclaim and prizes, and is included in major collections such as the Museum of Modern Art New York and the Ruble Museum.
Most of Yanagi’s designs are very simple and beautiful. His products illustrate his thinking: true beauty is not made, it is born naturally. When he created a new product, he made the first versions over and over by hand, seeking new forms that took shape from both new and old ideas..
Sori Yanagi died at the age of 96 in 2011″
-Quoted From Wikipedia
About Sori Yanagi
Download our Sake Vessel Cheat sheet:
Skip to: 11:53 Sake Introduction and Tasting: Shishinosato Junmai Ginjo Shun
Shishinosato Junmai Ginjo Shun
Acidity: 1.6
Alcohol: 14.0%
Brand: Shishinosato
Brewery: Matsuura Shuzo
Classification: Junmai Ginjo
Importer/Distributor: Skurnik
Prefecture: Ishikawa
Rice Type: Yamadanishiki
Seimaibuai: 55%
SMV: -1.0
Yeast: Kyokai 14
Skip to: 29:02 Show Closing
This is it! Join us next time for another episode of Sake Revolution!
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Episode 128 Transcript
John Puma: 0:21
Hello everybody and welcome to Sake Revolution. If you were looking for America’s First Sake podcast, you found it, uh, you’ve also found me, John Puma of the Sake Notes. I am one of your hosts and the administrator over at the Internet Sake Discord, as well as the Reddit r slash sake community.
Timothy Sullivan: 0:41
And I’m your host, Timothy Sullivan. I am a Sake Samurai. I’m a sake educator, as well as the founder of the Urban Sake website. Every week, John and I will be here tasting and chatting about all things sake and doing our best to make it fun and easy to understand.
John Puma: 0:58
Mm.
Timothy Sullivan: 0:59
Yes?
John Puma: 1:01
back Tim.
Timothy Sullivan: 1:02
Yes. And this week we are going to be venturing again into the world of sake, vessels, and a accoutrements, which is a big hot a accoutrements, uh, vessels
John Puma: 1:15
we got sake, vessels and accoutrements.
Timothy Sullivan: 1:17
Sake, cups and Tchotchke and I love it all. I have
John Puma: 1:21
All right.
Timothy Sullivan: 1:24
So what are, what are, what are some of the vessels we talked about on the show before we had, uh, Kikichoko, the standard sake tasting cup with the blue rings at the bottom. Recently we’ve done Ochoko, we’ve done masu, the square wooden box, and we also did the Sakazuki, the more ceremonial, uh, saucer like shape. But today we’re moving into the 20th century with some modern design.
John Puma: 1:55
Uh, modern designs. Okay. Okay.
Timothy Sullivan: 2:00
Now, when we did the kikichoko episode where we talked about that standard cup, and if you know we describe it to you, once you see it, you can’t unsee it.
John Puma: 2:09
Yes, absolutely.
Timothy Sullivan: 2:12
it’s very similar to the cup that we’re going to be talking about today. Once you recognize this and you see it, you know a little bit about the designer you’re gonna see it everywhere. It’s a very common cup shape, don’t you think?
John Puma: 2:27
It is, it is. It’s one that I, I see quite often actually.
Timothy Sullivan: 2:32
Well, maybe I can give our listeners a little bit of a description of the cup we’re gonna be looking at today and then kind of unique situation this week. We actually have a little bit of a bio of the mid-century designer that designed this cup, and it has become such an icon that, as we said, you see it everywhere.
John Puma: 2:57
Yeah, it is a very, very common cup. And, you know, up until we started doing, our discussions about this episode, I didn’t even know there was like a story behind it. So this is like, this has been a bit of a, a learning experience for me. Just, you know, just finding out that there was a thing about it. So, uh, he said, yeah, let’s, uh, let’s, let’s chat a little bit more. What, what is this cup that we are talking about?
Timothy Sullivan: 3:20
So this is a clear glass cup. I often describe it as the mid-century footed cup.
John Puma: 3:28
Mm-hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 3:28
is like an upside down bell shape. So basically there is a thick solid glass foot. For about an inch or an inch and a half, and then it has a simple glass bowl on top of that. So it’s a footed glass and it raises it up off the table just a little bit. It’s not a stem, it’s really like, like a foot. And this is a glass that was designed by a contemporary of Charles and Ray Eames and many other famous mid 20th century designers. His name is, Sori Yanagi he is very well known in Japan as an industrial designer, and he focused on the usefulness and beauty and simplicity of everyday objects.
John Puma: 4:22
Mm-hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 4:23
He’s actually the son of a famous designer as well. His father was Soetsu Yanagi. founded a movement that really celebrated the beauty of everyday objects. So he was born into this world where his father really dedicated his life to the crafts of Japan and kind of celebrating the beauty of the folk arts.
John Puma: 4:47
Hmm
Timothy Sullivan: 4:47
when he got into the post-war period, he became a designer himself. So he graduated from the Academy of Fine Arts in Japan and also studied at an architectural office. So he has background both in arts and architecture, but he ended up being one of the most famous industrial designers in Japan.
John Puma: 5:09
Oh
Timothy Sullivan: 5:10
Yeah, and just like a lot of mid-century artists and craftspeople, some of his most famous furniture designs focus on bent plywood. So Charles and Ray Eames are really famous mid-century designers, and they did a lot of bent plywood in the late forties and fifties. And his most famous furniture design is the butterfly stool,
John Puma: 5:32
Mm-hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 5:33
that’s actually in the collection of the Museum of Modern Art in New York. In the permanent collection and we’ll put a picture of Yanagi’s Butterfly Stool in our show notes once you see it. If you’re familiar at all with mid-Century Designer Furniture, you’ll probably recognize that right away. And he designed this sake cup as well. Again, it’s a solid foot and a simple glass bowl, and it is all clear glass and just so beautiful on the table.
John Puma: 6:06
Yeah. Yeah, something I did not realize was, was a modern cup. I always thought of it as like being kind of classic, kind of like, you know, a little bit, older. Um, so it’s very interesting to me to hear this and this history about it, and that’s, that’s really nice.
Timothy Sullivan: 6:21
Yeah. You know, I, I searched and I searched and I searched, and I could not find the year that Yanagi designed this cup, so I couldn’t find a year, he was born in 1915 and he died in 2011.
John Puma: 6:39
Hm.
Timothy Sullivan: 6:41
So he lived well into the 21st century, but was most active in the latter half of the 20th century. And this cup, from a sake lover’s point of view, This cup is like, I don’t know. It’s a, it’s a monumental contribution to the world of sake because it’s so ubiquitous and so well loved. And it is a very modern design. Like this is definitely a post-war period design. Um, but very clean and very simple and it follow, his rules of design very clearly, where the simplicity of the object is to be celebrated. I actually have a quote from, Sori Yanagi, he said, whether handcrafted or manufactured, a design is born from its connection to everyday life, and this is also the source of its true beauty.
John Puma: 7:44
Hmm. I like
Timothy Sullivan: 7:45
So he was very into designing for things that people touched every day, used every day, that were part of their everyday goings about in life. And nothing could be more indicative of that than a simple but beautiful sake cup.
John Puma: 8:00
Nice. Very nice. Yeah. Now, um, I can’t, I’m trying to think of like where and when. I would’ve like first seen one of these and it was probably in like a, more like a modern zaki. That seems like it would probably have been that situation. Probably, uh, uh, a nice little set where they could, you know, where they like, Pour the socket into like a nice like glass caff and then you get these to like pour into like that is most likely when I first encountered these, these particular cups.
Timothy Sullivan: 8:30
Yeah. They’re wonderful to use at home too because they’re totally stable. They hold a good amount of sake. They come in different sizes. I have a medium size one here, they can hold four ounces on the larger side or just a couple ounces on the smaller side. And, uh, yeah, so just really useful. Utilitarian, but very beautiful.
John Puma: 8:55
It is so interesting that, that this was, that kind of organically, it seems became such a common piece of glassware in a lot of, Izakayas and, and other sake establishments, most of the other, vessels that we’ve talked about so far have had roots in like, the history of sake and sake is, uh, like, like the masu is all about, using it as a, as a measuring tool for Rice and, Kiki Choko being The official tool for, for tasting. Uh, so it’s so interesting to me that this is just like, this is a thing that somebody made and then independently, so many places were like, we like this. This is what we’re gonna use. That, that’s, uh, super interesting. It’s fascinating.
Timothy Sullivan: 9:39
yeah. Of all the vessels that we’ve featured so far, this was the first one that was designed in the post-war period, so after World War ii. And it was designed, I think, really with consumers in mind.
John Puma: 9:52
Mm.
Timothy Sullivan: 9:53
Like this didn’t come from the industry or some other thing. It, it, it was designed by an industrial designer with an eye on practicality beauty and the ease of use for the, for the end user.
John Puma: 10:08
Hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 10:09
that really speaks to why it became so popular. It was like this designer, Sori Yanagi was thinking of the people who are gonna be sipping sake out of it and
John Puma: 10:19
That makes a lot of sense. You know, I think that, when you’re designing something for, for people who knew you should really focus on, um, on the people and there he goes, doing that, doing just that.
Timothy Sullivan: 10:32
Yeah. I mean, the drinking out of the masu, the square wooden box is a lot of fun, but I don’t think they took into consideration like ease of use when you’re drinking out of a square, square wooden box,
John Puma: 10:44
I, I don’t think that was, uh, I don’t think that was, that was job one when they were putting that together.
Timothy Sullivan: 10:49
right. Yeah. So this, this glass is. Much more in line with that. And good news folks. This design is so transcendent that it is still manufactured and produced today. The the glass manufacturing company that produces this cup is called Toyo Sasaki. They sell this to this day. I don’t think it’s ever gone out of production since it was designed in the mid 20th century. So you can still buy these cups and they are wonderful to have on hand. They have that nice heavy base to them. A beautiful, uh, simple bowl on top of that. And we’re gonna test it out today and compare it with our wine glass and see how we do as we always do with our vessel series.
John Puma: 11:39
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It’s gonna be interesting to see how it stacks up Tim, so, um, what sake did we choose today to be our, our testing companion in our little journey?
Timothy Sullivan: 11:53
Yeah, we, we picked an interesting sake. This is a sake that I’ve never tasted before. So again,
John Puma: 11:59
that makes two of us. Tim
Timothy Sullivan: 12:01
we’re gonna get a true blind react from our wine glass and our yanagi footed cup.
John Puma: 12:09
Mm-hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 12:09
This sake also has a connection to another one of our episodes we had the author Hannah Kirshner on our show, we profiled her and her book Water, Wood, and Wild Things, which told the story of her life living in a Japanese mountain town. And in that book she talked about working for a particular sake brewery, and that was Matsuura Shuzo which is a small brewery in Ishikawa Prefecture.
John Puma: 12:42
Mm-hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 12:43
And they recently started exporting their sake. The brand is called Shishinosato so this was the sake brand that Hannah Kirshner was making when she was working there and writing that book that we featured previously on Sake Revolution. So shout out to Hannah and, uh, we finally have that sake in hand now that it’s sold in the States, and we could not be more thrilled. So the sake that we have from Shishinosato brand is their Junmai Ginjo “shun”.
John Puma: 13:17
Mm.
Timothy Sullivan: 13:18
this has an alcohol percentage of 14%, so it’s a little bit lower than usual. This is Yamadanishiki is the rice milled to 55%. And that’s, Yamadanishiki grown in Hyogo Prefecture, the sake meter value is a minus one. Acidity is at 1.6. The yeast is Kanazawa yeast number 14. And the Matsuura Shuzo is again in Ishikawa, Prefecture. And uh, yeah. So I’m really excited to taste this and we’re gonna do our Yanagi footed glass versus our wine glass and see how they compare. All right. You ready to get.
John Puma: 14:05
Before we do, I just wanted to say really quickly, two things about this. One is, Yeah. you mentioned that, the Yamadanishiki that they’re using over here in this Ishikawa brewery is from Hyogo, and I think that we have discussed in the past, I think specifically during our episode on Yamadanishiki, that. Hyogo kind of known for having, you know, growing the best Yamadannishiki, in the country. so it’s interesting that they’re, going ahead and bringing it over there to use in this product. That’s, that’s super fun, and then I also was, was wondering, and this is probably an opinion thing, so I’m wondering what you think,
Timothy Sullivan: 14:43
Hmm.
John Puma: 14:43
do you think. The reason that they started to export their sake, at this time was the attention that may have gotten them from the book.
Timothy Sullivan: 14:56
Yeah, that’s a really, that’s a really good question.
John Puma: 15:00
I do wonder about that.
Timothy Sullivan: 15:01
Yeah. Well, I think that I wouldn’t be surprised if Hannah’s book kicked off the conversation with
John Puma: 15:08
Hmm. Move the needle a little bit.
Timothy Sullivan: 15:10
Oh, for sure. And they may have wanted to export, and this was the, the they needed to get that started when people reading her book say, oh, I want to try this sake. So we’re super lucky to have this, imported to the states now and. I have never had anything from this brewery, so I’m really excited to try it.
John Puma: 15:34
That makes two of us. Tim, I have also never had this. so let’s open it up.
Timothy Sullivan: 15:47
All right, we’ve got the sake poured both into a wine glass. All right, so we’ve got the sake poured both into a wine glass and our Yanagi footed cup, the mid-century design cup. Where should we start, John?
John Puma: 16:08
Well, I think we should get, a baseline, and start with our guest cup. that’s been the,
Timothy Sullivan: 16:18
That’s
John Puma: 16:19
way we’ve been doing it, so we might as well
Timothy Sullivan: 16:20
All right, so I’ve got my Yanagi cup. You can see the sake very beautifully in this cup. Clear glass. Beautiful. Solid glass foot. Let’s take it to the nose and smell. Okay.
John Puma: 16:38
Hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 16:39
Smells good. But similar to our Kikichoko, I feel like some of the aroma is spreading out and not getting funneled to the nose like you would with a wine glass
John Puma: 16:55
R Possibly. I mean, when I look at this, and you, you, you mentioned that it has that, like that thicker stem, that thicker short stem, almost like a stump. And then after that it is, uh, it is a bowl. It sits on top of that, it, it does remind me in certain respects of a glass, Kiki Choco for functional purposes as far as like the top of the glass goes, like the part that you’re actually, um, Taking in the aroma and where you’re sipping from. It is just a, a straight round opening. so it does have a little bit of that going on. I do, I could see why you’d have a similar experience. I do feel like I’m getting a little bit more aroma than a Kikichoko usually give s me but this will be something we need to revisit when we, take in the aroma from the wine glass and we’ll really see if we’ve been missing anything. Right.
Timothy Sullivan: 17:47
Yeah. I think your description was amazing, John, where you said it’s like, it’s like an O Choco or a Kiki Choco on a, on a foot. It’s like there’s a base on it and it’s raised up off the table, but the bowl of the cup itself is very much like, just like a glass ochoko.
John Puma: 18:03
Hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 18:04
So there’s no, bowl to it, so to speak, where it’s gonna funnel aromas to your nose. It’s open on the top, just kind of straight sided.
John Puma: 18:11
just you have to write, it’s just straight down.
Timothy Sullivan: 18:14
Okay. Let’s give it a taste out of, the Yanagi footed Glass.
John Puma: 18:18
Okay.
Timothy Sullivan: 18:22
Hmm. Oh wow.
John Puma: 18:26
This is an
Timothy Sullivan: 18:27
That’s good.
John Puma: 18:28
Yeah. Hmm
Timothy Sullivan: 18:32
This sake has a very nice, savory component to it, and it’s very rich and layered. There’s a complexity here that’s really interesting.
John Puma: 18:44
There. There is.
Timothy Sullivan: 18:46
There’s some, there’s a little bit of fruitiness there as well, but it’s like jam. It’s
John Puma: 18:51
it starts out a little sweet.
Timothy Sullivan: 18:53
yeah, it’s like grape Smuckers. It’s like Smuckers jam a little bit very like,
John Puma: 19:01
exactly what you mean. Like it is, I, it’s,
Timothy Sullivan: 19:04
It’s
John Puma: 19:04
starts off a little sweet, a little jammy, and then it kind becomes dry.
Timothy Sullivan: 19:09
Hm.
John Puma: 19:11
And it has that, that not, not, not completely, but almost that fall off the ledge, finish
Timothy Sullivan: 19:19
Hmm.
John Puma: 19:19
at the end. But it’s such an interesting place to go from this like jammy kind of sweetness and then, Whew. Really nice. It’s a really nice journey though,
Timothy Sullivan: 19:30
Yeah. It tastes very high quality and very well structured.
John Puma: 19:37
right? This is, this is really good stuff. That’s nice.
Timothy Sullivan: 19:41
Yeah. And, and there there’s also a little bit of a, a rice component there too. So it’s like concentrated jammy fruit, very much preserved kind of, uh, uh, grape jam to start off with a little bit of sweetness. There’s a hint of rice in there for me as well. And then a, uh, more. Savory dry finish. So it’s, it’s like a journey. I feel like I’ve been taken on a journey.
John Puma: 20:07
Yes. Yeah, I think we have. Um, now while it’s fresh in our minds, let’s grab that wine glass and see what happens.
Timothy Sullivan: 20:14
Okay. So we’re now smelling out of the wine glass for comparison with our, uh, Shishinosato oh, wow. That’s again, much more concentrated aroma, don’t
John Puma: 20:29
much more concentrated, but I don’t think I’m getting a different aroma experience. I think there were a couple of situations with some of our other vessels where I was like, where was this aroma before? And in this case, I’m like, it’s, it’s. I had the search for the aroma before, but now it’s just in my face.
Timothy Sullivan: 20:46
yes. It feels like it was the same aroma, but somebody turned up the volume. Like it.
John Puma: 20:51
kind of. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Timothy Sullivan: 20:53
It was there before out of the, the footed glass. But here with the wine glass channeling those esters, those aromas right to your nose, you get it right away.
John Puma: 21:05
yeah. Uh, and it, it is right there and very nice. It’s now that I’m not, Searching for the aroma, I can say with a little more certainty.
Timothy Sullivan: 21:14
Yeah.
John Puma: 21:15
That’s a very nice aroma. There is, there is a touch of that, that sweetness that we tasted, that jammy sweetness
Timothy Sullivan: 21:23
Hmm.
John Puma: 21:23
on the nose and a little bit of that rice, I think.
Timothy Sullivan: 21:28
Hmm. Yeah. And, and for me, the, I’m getting some fruitiness as well, but for me it’s smelling mostly like stone fruits. When you think of like plums and apricots and that type of,
John Puma: 21:43
Right, which, which lends itself, to the
Timothy Sullivan: 21:45
yes. The. Hmm
John Puma: 21:49
Really nice. That’s nice. It’s a, it is that style of sake and I think that this is, maybe I have the bias it is autumn, this, this sake. And it might be that, that stone fruits just makes me think autumn. Like I, I’m, I feel like as I sip this, that I’m having this in the best time of year for this. Okay.
Timothy Sullivan: 22:10
Yeah. So this, you’re, you’re telling me this is a sake you’d want to have on a hay ride?.
John Puma: 22:15
Um,
Timothy Sullivan: 22:16
through the haunted
John Puma: 22:17
forest? A long time since I’ve been on a hair ride, Tim. Uh, They’re bouncy. It’s hard to drink sake on a hay ride, I would think. I, I think. But, but perhaps you know, maybe I’m sitting watching somebody else on a hay ride. I’m kind of sitting there and some pumpkins around.
Timothy Sullivan: 22:32
You’re leaf peeping in Vermont
John Puma: 22:34
There’s hay in the vicinity.
Timothy Sullivan: 22:36
You’re sitting on a hay bale
John Puma: 22:38
there you go. I can, I
Timothy Sullivan: 22:39
watching the leaves. Change color
John Puma: 22:41
That’s not bad. That’s, I could think of worse ways to spend my day
Timothy Sullivan: 22:46
All right, let’s give it a taste out the wine glass. Hmm.
John Puma: 22:57
Speaking of concentrated. Yeah, and it might be because the aroma is going in with it,
Timothy Sullivan: 23:04
Yeah.
John Puma: 23:05
I think I’m getting a much louder.
Timothy Sullivan: 23:08
Hmm.
John Puma: 23:09
You pointed out earlier, like, it seems like they turned up the volume. I’m getting a louder version of, of this sake. It’s, it’s the, the Fidelity The fidelity is definitely higher.
Timothy Sullivan: 23:22
HD
John Puma: 23:23
wine glass.
Timothy Sullivan: 23:24
eight K HD
John Puma: 23:25
hds.
Timothy Sullivan: 23:28
Yeah. Can I, can I say I actually enjoyed sipping it more from the footed glass?
John Puma: 23:34
really That’s interesting. Um,
Timothy Sullivan: 23:37
the aroma was more enjoyable from the wine glass, but just sipping on it, I felt that it moderated the amount that hit my palate at once. It wasn’t such a concentrated. Kaboom of, of that jammy flavor on my palate.
John Puma: 23:53
There is a kaboom
Timothy Sullivan: 23:54
I, I enjoyed the, the sipping from the footed glass, uh, just a little bit more. Of course, you can’t beat a wine glass. That’s why it’s the, what we compare everything to. Right. We use a wine
John Puma: 24:05
gotta rename the show, the Wine Glass Challenge or something like that.
Timothy Sullivan: 24:08
Yeah.
John Puma: 24:11
can you beat the wine glass
Timothy Sullivan: 24:13
we can’t use the, the w word
John Puma: 24:16
Oh my goodness. Um, I understand what you mean though. It is a lot more subtle, out of the Yanagi class.
Timothy Sullivan: 24:24
hmm.
John Puma: 24:26
I kind of like how loud it is out of the wine glass. I kind of en I’m enjoying just that. It is, uh, it is not shy and it is, it is a big, uh, a big, as we described earlier, that jammy flavor, like really nice. I like it.
Timothy Sullivan: 24:44
I do have to say one thing, regardless of which glass
John Puma: 24:48
Mm-hmm.
Timothy Sullivan: 24:49
this is 14% alcohol and it has a bigger footprint than that. I’m not saying it tastes boozy in any way, but I’m just saying it’s like, Here I am, like it, it is a richer, uh, bolder style and with a lower alcohol percentage. I just expected it to be quieter.
John Puma: 25:13
you’re absolutely right. Um, that’s an excellent, excellent point. And I wasn’t even thinking about the alcohol percentage when I was sipping on it. And yeah, like when you sip on this, you would think it had normal or high alcohol. Uh, and you know, seeing here that it is actually a low alcohol, 14% considered low alcohol sake, if I’m not mistaken.
Timothy Sullivan: 25:37
Well, I mean, it’s only 1% off, one and a half percent off
John Puma: 25:41
they consider, they consider like Natsu to be like a low alcohol sake and usually those around 14%. So that’s why I was kind of rolling with that. So it’s a slightly lower alcohol sake, but it doesn’t taste that way at all. It tastes, you know, it’s, it is not pulling any punches. It’s a, it’s got a big, fun flavor.
Timothy Sullivan: 26:03
Yeah. it has a richness to it, for sure. So John, we, we’ve used a number of different vessels over, over our series so far. How do you think this Yanagi footed cup is gonna fit into your repertoire? Do you think it’s something you’ll reach for more often now or not that much?
John Puma: 26:25
I think something that we learned here today was that it can be, Utilize to tone down your, your louder, your bigger sakes, those bigger, uh, flavor explosions. You want something that’s a little bit more subtle, you can use this cup, and it seems to, it seems to have that effect.
Timothy Sullivan: 26:47
Yeah, you can throttle. Clutch a little bit. Listen to me making a car metaphor,
John Puma: 26:53
Lookie. Yeah. I, that’s impressive, Tim.
Timothy Sullivan: 26:57
Yeah, that’s something we haven’t talked about and it’s kind of a good learning experience from this, from this tasting, is that if the sake might be more exuberant than you’d like for a given pairing or a given experience, you can moderate that with the type of cup that you use, and we’ve always. Talked about how the wine glass allows us to get the aroma better, get the aroma better, get the aroma better, but maybe you want to dial back the impact of the flavor and one of these alternate sake cups can do that. So it’s a really interesting takeaway from today.
John Puma: 27:31
Yeah. And I think that all of our other, experiences so far have been so, oh, well, I feel like I’m missing something. Oh. Or, or something like that. Or, oh, this is interesting. But, like, you know, the masu, the wooden masu adds flavor to it
Timothy Sullivan: 27:49
Yeah. Right,
John Puma: 27:49
the, changes the dynamic in that way. Um, and this is the first one that it’s just like, oh, this is a. This can be used as a tool to bring the sake to a place that you, uh, that is more towards your taste. Perhaps if you have something that is a little bit, you know, a bit louder, you want to have a little bit more of a subtle experience, this seems like a really good opportunity.
Timothy Sullivan: 28:14
I think if we had picked a different sake to try with this cup, we would’ve had a different experience. So it, it’s always the marriage of the sake and the vessel together. So we’re just having fun experimenting with different sakes and seeing how it works. But everyone at home really needs to try their sakes with their favorite cups and see what works for them and what they like best. It’s all about your personal preference.
John Puma: 28:38
Yeah. Really good stuff.
Timothy Sullivan: 28:40
All right. Well John, it’s great to taste with you. Thanks for exploring the history of this great designer with me. Again, that’s Sori Yanagi, and in the show notes on SakeRevolution.com, we’re gonna have photos of this beautiful footed cup along with some of Yanagi’s. Really famous furniture designs, so be sure to check the show notes. I want to thank all of our listeners for tuning in and a special hello and thank you to all of our patrons. We love our community on Patreon. And if you would like to join us and support Sake Revolution, please visit Patreon.com/SakeRevolution to learn more.
John Puma: 29:25
and if you would like to support us in other ways, you can. There’s great ways to do it. You can go to Apple Podcasts or whatever your podcast platform or choice might be, Spotify Chartable, etcetera. And leave us a review, tell people about your experience watching Sake Revolution. That’s gonna help get word out about our show So on that note, Tim, I hope you’ve got a glass handy
Timothy Sullivan: 29:53
I Sure do. I have, I have, I have. I have many glasses. I have to pick one.
John Puma: 29:57
All right, for everybody at home or wherever you’re listening to our show, please grab your sake vessel of choice. Remember to keep drinking sake and Kanpai. Woohoo.